Building a computer? Check here

Discussion in 'New Build / Upgrade Advice' started by Big B, Jul 31, 2002.

  1. Big B

    Big B HWF Godfather

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    This is more directed at the newbies building there PC's, but if you want my and other peoples opinions, here is some info on what companies are suggested for certain items. While other companies may not be listed, it is because I'm trying to go by personal experience.

    Motherboards
    These are companies I would personally recommend:

    -Asus--Very solid motherboards. They tend to have jumpers and are a tad pricey, but great stuff overall.

    -Abit--If you want overclocking, step inside where Abit is king. These tend to be a tad expensive as well, but are generally solid. Pretty easy to set up with a jumperless design (save for clearing CMOS)

    -AOpen--nothing fancy, but these are generally solid boards that just work, and do that very well.

    -ECS--These are basic motherboards, for the most part. If you're looking for features or lots of overclocking options, look elsewhere.

    -Gigabyte--They don't tend to be the best for overclocking, but they tend to be a company that offers some very tricked out motherboards with lots of goodies. If you want a board with PATA RAID, you'll want to check out Gigabyte.

    -Iwill--So far, I've been happy with the stability of my P4D. The company is aiming at producing server-level motherboards and it shows in their motherboards and reputation. If you don't see much of them, it's because they've all but withdrawn from the enthusiast/home market to concentrate on server products.

    -MSI, or Micro Star--All around solid, well priced motherboards with plenty of hardware features.

    -Tyan--noted for server-class motherboards, these are fairly skimpy on hardware extras on consumer motherboards, but are very stable motherboards.

    -Soyo---They seem to be making a slight comeback. If you're looking for a board to overclock the crap out of, look elsewhere. On the flip side, the offer some very solid motherboards with loads of extras. Soyo is being purchased by PCChips, which also owns ECS.

    -SuperMicro--extremely high-quality boards. Unlike the others mentioned, this company produces boards for Intel CPU's only. They make mostly server boards and these tend to be quite expensive (starting at $300USD--$900+)

    Video cards
    These are video card companies I would recommend.

    -ATI--You want your Radeon? Buy the "Built by ATI" ones. This company has done a real improvement in the drivers arena.

    -Gainward--Like overclocking? Gainward is known for their highly overclockable cards. They tend to have a rather skimpy software package, and tend to be slightly expensive.

    -Hercules--While they no longer produce nVidia based cards, the GeForce 2 and 3 lines were excellent. If you want to color coordinate your system, they use blue PCB's (printed circuit board). Hercules has recently dropped out of the video card biz due to some conflicts with ATi regarding designs.

    -MSI--Like their motherboards, MSI's video card lineup feature solid, well priced cards that usually come with some great hardware goodies.

    -PNY--They've never been the flashiest or highest OC'ing, but they work. Generally, they're priced pretty average.

    -Sapphire--One of the oldest partners for ATi, they've got good cards at reasonable prices. Not the absolute cheapest, but they won't break the bank.
     
  2. Big B

    Big B HWF Godfather

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    Continued...

    Chipsets
    Probably should've addressed this first, but I'll do it now. While choosing a chipset can limit which options you get, it ultimately rests on what the motherboard company chooses to put up. Here's a list of what to expect on Intel and AMD boards currently available:

    Intel chipsets

    Intel--Bar none, the best chipsets you can buy are from Intel. If you are nervous about conflicts and incompatibilities, I suggest going with an Intel CPU and a board featuring an Intel chipset. Typically, motherboards made by Intel do not offer as many frills as 3rd party solutions, although this is changing somewhat.
    Current chipsets: i875 (Canterwood), i865 (Springdale), i848P, i925 (Alderwood), i915 (Grantsdale).

    ATi--Yes, the same ATi making the Radeon X800 chips has a motherboard chipset out, and this time around, it's actually pretty good.
    Current chipset: Radeon 9100IGP

    SiS--Up until recently, Sis has had mediocre products at best. Lately, their chipsets have been a solid and fast alternative to Intel's own chipsets at a slightly lower cost. SiS is the official 3rd party chipset company for the Pentium 4.
    Current chipsets: 655

    ALi/ULi--Like Sis, ALi hasn't been known for anything that's been mind-blowing and Iwill has been about the only company producing any of their chipsets. Unlike the AMD side of things, ALi's Intel chipsets haven't received much press at all. I don't have much info on these chipsets as I haven't seen a whole lot to read up on.
    Current chipsets: ???

    VIA--Only a few motherboard companies are producing boards based on the P4X*** series. Recently, VIA has acquired the proper P4 licsence to produce a Pentium 4 chipset
    Current chipsets: PT800 (single-channel DDR), PT880 (dual-channel DDR)

    AMD chipsets

    AMD--While CPU's are a major part of AMD's operations, they've gotten a few chipsets out that are one of the better solutions on the market. Unfortunately, the AMD760 and it's variants (760MP, 760MPX) aren't the speediest options around anymore. If you want an AMD chipset-based motherboard, it might be better to hold off until the AMD8000 chipset series launches with the Hammer/K8 processors.
    Current chipset: AMD 8000 series (Opteron)

    ALi/ULi--While not a major force in the AMD market, ALi's Majik DDR 333 chipset has been making waves in the form of the Iwill XP333. It does have some problems and is not the fastest thing available, but people have been accepting it as a stable alternative to Via.
    Current chipset: ???

    nVidia--One of the two major players in gaming graphics, nVidia has stepped into the motherboard arena with the highly integrated nForce chipset. These chipsets offer some of the best integrated features seen yet and are on par with Via's latest offerings. The one weakness is that they have a reputation to not overclock very well---which may not be a big deal for you.
    If you are looking for a stable alternative to Via, the nForce may be for you.
    Current chipsets: nForce 2 400(single channel), nForce 2 Ultra 400 (dual channel), nForce 2 Ultra 400Gb, nForce 3 Pro 150 (Athlon 64), nForce 3 250Gb (Athlon 64).

    SiS--Their Pentium 4 market is strong, but the AMD sector has been relatively unexciting, and not really what I'd consider to be anything for a power user.
    Current chipsets: 746FX, 755 (Athlon 64)

    VIA--Right now, VIA is the biggest player on the AMD side of the chipset market. While they've taken some major flak for poor chipsets in the past, they've come back with some very solid offerings as of late. Of course, not everyone likes them (besides Intel :chk: ), so you will hear numerous jaded opinions on them. I've never had a problem with thier products, but this will vary from person to person. If you're serious about overclocking, this is the best you can get.
    Current chipsets:KT600, KT880 (dual-channel DDR), K8T800 (Athlon 64), K8T800 Pro (Athlon 64)

    Expansion slots

    ISA---Officially retired as a standard, but some motherboards do carry them because of niche market demands. These slots are 8- or 16-bit slots. Typically black and lie toward the bottom of a motherboard.

    PCI---The 32-bit version that is seen on motherboards is, well, 32-bit. While there are variants of PCI, the main one that you'll be looking at is the 32-bit, 33MHz version. It's the jack of all trades when it comes to expansion card availability. However, faster variations are made because this PCI slot is an extention of the PCI bus and limited to 133MB/second, and can become a bottleneck for high-end SCSI controllers and high-end Gigabit NICs.

    PCI Express (PCIe/PCI-E)---this is not the same thing as PCI-X. PCI-X is a 64-bit 100 or 133MHz slot seen on high-end server motherboards. PCIe is a newer PCI standard based on 'lanes' from the chipset. Each lane runs 250MB/s, which is nearly double of what the current PCI bus does. The first round of PCIe will have 20-24 lanes at it's disposal, depending on the chipset. The more lanes allocated for a single PCIe slot, the more bandwith it has. Each PCIe 16x slots will leave 4-8 PCIe tunnels open for less bandwith hungry cards like sound cards. PCIe 16x slots will be the replacement for AGP, but in the end won't really be any more effective since all it's really doing is raising an pretty much untouched ceiling.
    AGP slots won't drop out of sight immediately. Although Intel's upcoming i915 and i925X chipsets will drop AGP, several companies have previewed i915 boards with AGP. The reason they can do this is because the AGP slot is an overglorified PCI slot running at 66MHz (AGP 1x). How well it works remains to be seen. Via's PT890 Pentium 4 chipset will officially sport both AGP and PCIe, for the record.
    Because PCI and PCIe slots are different architectures, they will coexist on motherboards for some time.

    BTX
    BTX formfactor--Balance eXtended Technology. It is a new motherboard formfactor created by Intel and will be available later this year. However, it has recieved sharp criticism because of the way it doesn't appear to do anything all that great---if anything. Additionally, AMD does not seem to be making any real effort to support this. While AMD is Intel's rival, it appears that most motherboard companies are pretty much ignoring the standard. Possible reasons are that it doesn't appear to really be all that great at dissapating heat like it's been touted. Another problem is that it's been cited as being a fix for the Prescott Pentium 4 core, which has some serious heat issues. Lastly, it's rumored that the AMD 64-bit processor boards (both Socket 754 and 939) would be unable to fit the BTX spec.
     
  3. Big B

    Big B HWF Godfather

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    Sound cards

    While separate audio solutions are still usually a better buy, the onboard audio solutions nowadays aren't half bad anymore, so I'll be discussing this stuff too in this part of the guide.
    Again, I'll be sticking with what I've run across, so keep in mind there are other products besides what I'm listing.

    Integrated sound
    C-Media--These have been popularized by Asus and Iwill, but are finding their way onto boards by the likes of Abit and MSI. These aren't anything fancy, but the sound is a step above the standard AC '97 and support 5.1 channel audio

    nForce/nForce 2 Soundstorm--Part of the integration is 5.1, Dolby-Digital sound. The sound is very good, though the drivers currently lack some user adjustable controls like bass and treble, much less an equalizer. Soundstorm is a qualification and boards with this have the nForce MCP-T southbridge.

    Sound cards
    Creative--The Live! series was pretty good, but it did have some issues with Via chipsets, particularly when it came to the infamous 686B southbridge. Their latest creation, the Audigy is a souped-up version of the live with Firewire/IEEE1394. They are still taking flak, and rightly so, for their bloated software and drivers. While I haven't run into, their cards are notorious for trouble in multiprocessor environments.

    Hercules--This is the main competitor to Creative, other than Their mid-range solution, the Fortissimo II is, in my opinion, better sounding than the Audigy, and at half the cost. There were some driver issues, but they have been fixed with the latest drivers. On the high-end of things, the Theater XP offers 6.1 channel sound and a phat breakout box with loads of connections, which pits it against Creatives Audigy Platinum offerings. They have released 2 newer cards, the Fortissimo III and the Digifire 7.1. The Digifire is the Fortissimo III with a Firewire port.

    Philips--Up until recently, I hadn't used a Philips sound card. I got the budget 4.1 card, and it's awesome.

    M-Audio--I have not used these cards before, but they are gaining a following by some as a better bang for the buck for the audiophiles and said to be better than the Audigy. Their current Revolution 7.1 is based on VIA's Vinyl Audio chip.

    IDE RAID
    Here I'll talk about the most common IDE RAID controllers you'll find integrated onto motherboards and the companies typically associated with them.

    Promise--While their controllers are fine, they require a different BIOS to function in RAID or as a standalone IDE controller. This is a problem if you simply want to use the controller as an extra IDE controller. Asus and Gigabyte usually make it possible to switch between RAID and non-RAID modes, but not everyone else does.
    If you are planning on a RAID solution, I feel that the Promise controllers are a better solution.
    Companies typically using Promise controllers: Asus, ECS, Gigabyte, MSI, SuperMicro, Chaintech, and Tyan.

    HighPoint--barring the HPT366 farce (known to cause errors), HighPoint's products have been very flexible, even when integrated onto motherboards. You can simply use them as standalone IDE controllers without having to check if the motherboard company has given you the option to do so. Of course, if you so desire RAID, you can do that too. For flexiblity, you can't beat HighPoint.
    Companies typically using HighPoint controllers: Abit, Epox, Iwill, Soyo.

    nVidia: With the release of the nForce 3 250Gb, they now offer integrated SATA ports.

    ITE: I don't know much about them right now, but a few of their IDE RAID controllers have popped up on someo Gigabyte boards.

    Silicon Image (formerly CMD): They produce the SiL3112A and SiL3114 (4-channel SATA) Serial ATA chip frequently found on motherboards today.

    Via: They also have an IDE RAID chip that has cropped up on a few motherboards. The latest southbridge includes SATA RAID as well.

    Note: both HighPoint and Promise produce standalone controller cards available for purchase.

    The latest Southbridges from Intel and Via both have optional SATA ports built in. Most i865/875/848P based boards and most KT600 boards feature the chips with the integrated SATA.
     
  4. Big B

    Big B HWF Godfather

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    Hard Drives

    Here's what I'd recommend.

    Maxtor---I've had to RMA a few drives, but they have an excellent, no BS policy that gets you a drive back quickly. I'm using a couple of Maxtors in my main box as we speak and I've had them about a year without any problems.

    Seagate---Another solid pick, especially if you're intrested in going SCSI.

    Western Digital--I've had only 1 of their drives die and it was an old 4.3GB drive. WD produces very solid hard drives, and currently make "Special Edition" drives that feature a large 8MB cache as opposed to the 2MB typically seen on IDE drives. These drives are 80GB and higher only, so don't look for anything under there. These drives are very close to SCSI speeds at a much lower cost. Because they no longer offer SCSI drives, they are able to put out their 10,000RPM Serial ATA hard drives.



    The only company I would steer the hell away from is IBM. These are failure prone drives that should not be entrusted to any of your data. I've had 2 of their 60GXP drives, both have failed despite having a hard drive cooler on each. Anything before the 75GXP series of hard drives is probably okay. Hitatchi has taken over the hard drive biz from IBM, and those drives seem to be alright.

    Optical Drives

    For all your CD, DVD and CD-RW needs, here's what I'll recommend.

    AOpen---These guys make just about everything for a computer, but they make good stuff. Their CD-ROMs have served me well.

    Hewlett-Packard--While expensive, HP does make some good burners.

    Lite-ON---Haven't had too much experience with their stuff, but so far, I'm impressed with my 40x burner. Currently there seem to be some problems between Lite-ON drives and nForce 2 boards, but not everyone is running into them.

    Pioneer--Like their audio equipment, Pioneer drives are high quality

    Panasonic--I've been impressed with their CD-players, and their optical drives for the PC are no different. Solid hardware.

    Sony--On the expensive side, IMO, but nothing to sneeze at.

    Samsung--There memory is good stuff, and so are their optical drives.

    Toshiba---I've had 2 of their DVD-ROM drives, one a 6x that's nearly 3 or 4 years old and still kicking away.
     
  5. Big B

    Big B HWF Godfather

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    Network Adapters

    If you don't have an integrated NIC on your motherboard and want to LAN it and/or are getting Cable or DSL...heck even if you don't yet, it might be a good idea to prepare yourself.

    3Com--very solid choice. These will run a bit more than the generic NICs, but they are some of the best. If having the speediest network is important, you'll want to take a look.

    D-Link--Nice and cheap. I've been very happy with my 530TX+.

    Intel--basically the other high-end NIC company. Again, it'll cost you more, but you get a solid NIC.

    Kensington---they make perpherials, but the NIC's I've run across are fine and, again, cheap.

    NForce/nForce 2 NIC---yeah, I'm going over the nForce again. Nvidia didn't do a shabby job on their NIC setup from my experience. You will only find this guy on nForce boards.

    nForce 2 MCPgB/3 250GB---nVidia added a hardware firewall feature to the latest versions of their nForce 2/3 chipsets and integrated Gigabit ethernet. This is good because the GbE won't have to share like it would on the PCI bus.

    M@rvell---So far, I've really only seen these on motherboards from the likes of Asus, but they seem to work fine.

    Realtek--while generally used by 3rd party companies and integrated onto motherboards, these are another cheap alternative to Intel nics if you aren't required to have one.

    Mice

    Heeeere, mousey-mousey! Yeah, your digital rat needs to be good.

    Logitech--These are also very solid. I've been happy with MS mice, but Logitech makes good stuff too. Their MX series of wired and wireless mice have come into their own in gaming.

    Microsoft---I've primarily used their mice for most of my time in computing, and I especially like their optical ones---which are definitely worth the money.


    Keyboards

    Who cares? It's a frickin' keyboard! They are all the same!
    Au contrare.

    AOpen---Keep It Simple Stu----err Silly. Nothing fancy here, but I don't care so long as they work. These are also pretty cheap.

    Logitech---I've had the keyboard I'm typing this on for over 4 years built buy this company. I live with 5 cats, and while they don't get into my room often, the fur can still get there. I haven't cleaned it in several years either and it still works great.


    Cases

    Housing for the PC should be sturdy and have good airflow. If you're not going to mod it, make sure the ventilation in the front is good, meaning not blocked.

    Antec--not cheap, but they make some spacious, sturdy cases. Some of their cases can be found under the brands Uneec or Chieftech

    AOpen--sturdy cases here and at a good price.

    Super Case--these don't always manage to be the greatest to work with, but they are decent and generally not too expensive.


    Brands don't really matter as much as good airflow. Avoid cases that don't have decent intake in the front.

    Power Supplies

    Antec--These are good power supplies for heavy loads, nuff said.

    Sparkle--I've had good luck with this company as well. I have a very loaded system running off their 350 W PSU without problems. Fortron branded power supplies are the same thing as Sparkle, just a different brand from the same company.
     
  6. Kenshin

    Kenshin Geek Trainee

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    For d-link i prefer the 530TXS its worked the best for me, cause the 530tx had problems with instalation, IMO but anyways good sugesstions i am going to be building a computer for my parents soon, they get my old voodoo 5 5500 and i get the 9800 pro or 9500 pro have not decided yet
     
  7. xen_chris

    xen_chris Guest

    i would like to add something to your exposeum:
    sound cards: terratec aureon sky 5.1, and space 7.1. they are using a via envy 24 chip, highly appreciated in the profesionnal segment of the market.
    logitech mice: mx500 with a wire and mx700 wireless.
    keyboards from microsoft.
    ddram producers: kingmax and infineon.
    network adapters: 3com, smc or allied telesyn.
    cd-rw: plextor, of course. it is not cheap, but delivers top quality. i sound like in a tv commercial.
    about dvd's, well toshiba rules. and lite-on is quite good on various tests.
    video cards: i would also add leadtek. they are very well seen, at least in my country. :d
     
  8. Sniper

    Sniper Administrator Staff Member

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    Big B, if possible could you update this, if there is need to and add more details about each company? we could use it as an article for the site!?

    let me know
     
  9. Big B

    Big B HWF Godfather

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    We'll see. ;) I've got a couple of ideas brewing. I'll be starting the chaos next week.
     

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