CRT vs LCD sticky

Discussion in 'Video Cards, Displays and TV Tuners' started by Swansen, Jan 29, 2007.

  1. Swansen

    Swansen The Ninj

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    CRT Displays
    CRT's (cathode ray tube) displays have been the standard for a very long time mostly due to reliability and cost. As other display types become less costly and last longer the CRT is startingto become phased out. However CRT's still have relevance due to their very high contrast ratio (difference between black and white) and their visual quickness. Meaning they can display many different colors and really great contrasts without any real noticeable flaws. What that means is that if you have a lot of different colors on the screen at once (i.e. a game) and they are changing rapidly, every image change will be smooth and response full, no image lag or ghosting or artifacting. Also CRT's do not have many issues, or any with viewing angles.

    CRT Specs and things to look for
    - Horizontal Refresh Rate
    (for most people 85 to 100hz are comfortable)
    - Viewable Size
    (the advertised size and the actual screen size are different, i.e. a 19'' CRT should have viewable size, actual screen, of 18'' and inch smaller)
    - Dot Pitch
    (although the dot pitch is not much of an issue anymore, it should the lowest number possible 0.20 to 0.22mm, it is the size of any pixel on the screne)
    - Cabinet Size
    (the actual size of the monitor, as this can be an issue as CRTs can get very bulky)
    - Size and screen contour
    (while your at it you might as well get a flat panel CRT for view ability and get a good size, 19'' is a good size and if you can fit it a 20'')

    CRT CONCLUSION
    To be completely honest, CRT's are great, but they are on the way out, some companies have stopped manufacturing them and other display types are catching up very quickly. If you really want a CRT then you are an extremely hard core gamer on a budget or you are a professional and image quality and accuracy are the absolute most important thing on your list and are mission critical.

    LCD Displays
    LCD's (liquid crystal display) have been around for a good while to, around the 1970's but they were very expesive and not very reliable. LCD's have made a lot of headway recently and have come a long way since their creation. Thats not to say they are not without their faults, they still have a long ways to go, and when shopping for a LCD it is very important to look at the details. The obvious advanteges of LCD's are their size and weight. LCD's fall behind CRT's the most when involving images vibrance and image quickness because of the way the light is utilized and controlled in a CRT, which is much different than in a LCD. Although these issues are becoming less and less of a problem as the technology progresses. Also a note on dead pixels they are less of a problem than they used to be, and most company or retailers have a warrenty against them, if they do occur.

    LCD Specs and things to look for
    - Response Time
    (16ms is a little to slow for most people, but if you just surf the net or an occasional movie, that should be fine. However 8ms is as high as i would think about, should be ok for casual gaming, movie watching. Although i wouldn't seriously consider anything unless it is at or below 6ms,but the lower the better. Also you want black to white or vise versa, but not GTG, which is gray to gray and not the real response time)
    - Contrast Ratio
    (A nice contrast ratio is the hardest thing to find in a LCD. 1000:1 is great, although i wouldn't really recommend going any lower that 700:1, at the very lowest 600:1)
    - Brightness
    (the magic number here seems to be around 300 cd/m2, this is the best for serious movie watching and gaming, but 250 should be fine as well)
    - Resolution
    (This is something that should be considered, LCD's have issues with displaying outside of their native resolutions. The image can become blurred or a little fuzzy. This is more apparent on displays with lower quality specs)
    - Viewing Angle
    (this isn't such an issue for most, as they are the only ones looking at their displays, usually straight at it. This is more for people who watch movies and the such, measured in degrees, so if its 160, then the image will be displayed correctly until you go past 160 degrees horizontally or vertically)

    LCD CONCLUSION
    Currently LCD's are the way to go. They are supported by pretty much every manufacturer who makes displays and they make advances all the time. One thing that needs to be said, do some serious shopping around, don't just stick to one retailer just because you like them, as they might not carry a LCD thats sufficient. As the technology advances the cost of LCD's continues to decrease as well as the gaps in performance. I would recommend getting an LCD in most cases, the only case i wouldn't would be if you are an absolute extreme gamer or designer on a real budget. Once you start getting into the higher contrast ratios and lower response times, LCD's and CRT's are almost indistinguishable.

    Consider the Following
    (a note on widescreen type displays and serious pursuers of LCD displays)

    -Widescreens Its almost a fact that widescreen displays are the future trend as manufactures push certain resolutions and displays. As far as i can see, i really see no reason to not go widescreen, as i have said, its becoming more and more commonplace, even in the gaming arena. Most games will more than likely support widescreen resolutions as many already do. It is just a good investment, also if something doesn't support a widescreen resolution then the black bars are put into play, and you can just think of them as large bezel.

    -Serious LCD Pursuers Basically some additional information you should consider if you want to really get into LCD's. Some important info that should be considered is the panel type the display uses, as well as where the panel is manufactured and at what order they get their panels. For example Samsung and LG make their own panels and are the first to use them directly. Also currently and from what i have researched, the best small LCD's that i have found are manufactured by LG, they have a lifetime warrenty against Dead Pixels and have absolutely great contrast ratios and response time for the cost. Response times at 5ms and contrast ratios at 2000:1!!! Link_to_Panel_Types also check out www.flatpanels.dk - Din guide til fladskærme some of it is in German or something but they have some of the panel types for some displays. Panel types are pretty hard to find as most retailers don't give out that information.

    edited 2-21-2007
  2. pelvis_3

    pelvis_3 HWF Member For Life

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    Looks good, but just a couple of things I have to mention:
    Your post is very compact and a little difficult to read. Consider some revision.

    Response Time- 8ms is not very high. While yes, the lower the better, 8ms was the sweet spot where manufacturers seemed to have eliminated blurring. Some of the better manufacturers like LG and Samsung manufactured 12ms monitors without any noticeable blur. 8ms is fine for any use, even hardcore gaming.
  3. Swansen

    Swansen The Ninj

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    yeah, at the time it looked good, i'll go back over it, but in my defense, you really don't want anything higher than 8ms, reason being is if you find a monitor that has certain specs and has 12ms for response time, and you will more than likely be able to find a monitor that has the same or better specs at the same price only with 8ms. Also, response time is getting better all the time and it isn't really a price issue anymore, i bought my monitor like a year ago and it has 3ms for response time for a around $300. Now i can find a monitor that has way better specs and maybe a little worse or the same response time for half that price. So what i'm saying is if you really want to compete with a CRT then 8ms is about as high as you want to go.
  4. strad

    strad Geek Trainee

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    LCD's are mature and the size are large enough to compete.

    Make sure you get one with at least 2 HDMI ports or you will end up having to get a HDMI switch externally connected to connect multiple HD sources.
    Trust me, you want HDMI for displaying the HD, it is simply the best digital video quality available.
  5. Swansen

    Swansen The Ninj

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    Minus the fact the HDCP is horrible, and HDMI doesn't output the right resolutions for general computer displays. Plus, DVI outputs really nice quality, like really nice, look it up, even VGA, and you don't have to deal with any of that HDCP crap incolved with HDMI. Leave HDMI to the TV world, on that, display port will be the HDMI of the computer world. So, unless you plan on using your computer monitor for watching TV, i completely disagree.
  6. TheIceman

    TheIceman Geek Trainee

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    well i repair tvs and electronics for a living, and ill say this: crts are definately the norm (old school) and i know pretty much all the ins and outs when it comes to working with them. lcds, however, almost feel like i need to learn a whole new trade. Sort of the same way an 80s mechanic would feel working on a 21st century hybrid.
    now, as for image quality, thats definately debatable. lcd provides about the sharpest image you could want, but i have seen crt HDtvs that make some of the most gnarly lcd HDtvs look like maybe theyre not going to be so quick to take out the crt market
  7. Swansen

    Swansen The Ninj

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    Interesting, but yes, i have an HDCRT and its a big mug, but i absolutely LOVE the picture quality, there really isn't any comparison to any of my friends LCDs. I have a friend with a plasma and it compares very nicely to even that.
  8. luke992006

    luke992006 Geek Trainee

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    crt's don't use dvi, so the quality of the picture is not as crisp. Also they are heavy and bulky. Also, crt monitor technology uses what is called an electron gun to display colours, ect onto the monitor, some of these electrons pass threw the screen and are bombarded onto you. It has never been proven that this does any serius harm over prolonged activity other then eye sight, it damages eye sight.

    LCD monitors can you digital (dvi and hdmi is digital, vga is analog) so the quality is more crisp, they also you liquid crystal display tech so no electron gun, also lcd monitors can have as low as 2ms response time which is just as fast as crt monitors (as anything fast is not noticable even on a monitor that scales badly) With a quality contrast ratio, (not dynamic contrast as you should not go by that) the colours are also just as vivid as crt's. So unless your on an very very tight budget there is no reason what so ever to buy a crt monitor.

    Also, crt monitors do not last nearly as long and consume more power then lcd's.
    ok batman, why is hdcp posiby horrible (you do know that just means that hd content can be played on the monitor in question right. Hdmi is digital, dvi is digital, they are nearly identicle there is no difference between them onther then hdmi has slightly faster speeds and is smaller. There is no resolution problems when using hdmi or dvi. Also hdcp has nothing to do with hdmi. Hdcp again is just the ability to play hd content, you can use a dvi cable as well, but for the norm tv's and blu ray players use hdmi cables. Some new monitors are moving to hdmi because the cable is faster, and smaller.
  9. Swansen

    Swansen The Ninj

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    :dry: right, i'm not going to start a debate in a sticky, but first off, you need to provide sources for statements such as
    because it isn't and a video side by side comparisons have been done to show the difference, its noticeable. However, i must state that most of this stuff now is irrelevant other than for the purpose of conversation and for TVs. LCDs contrast is NO WHERE NEAR a CRTs, not even close, especially on the ever popular and cheap TN panel.
    You contradicted yourself there, but i will agree, very prolonged use does seem to effect eye site, however, this isn't an issue for TVs as most people aren't close enough to their TVs to be effected. HDCP is horrible because its absolutely unneeded and its only purpose it to hinder people that don't have digital right management on their HD content. HDCP is just silly, it doesn't allow HD content to be played, it just infringes on freedoms, it was a nightmare with Vista, causing all kinds of problems on even non HD content.
    I'm honestly not even sure what that means? Yes a LCD can potentially last forever, but a CRT can be rebuilt if it needs repair and CRTs last a VERY long time. The bandwidth difference between VGA and DVI is very negligible, and while we are on it, component video as well, we still don't have enough content to over load any of the aformentioned connection technologies. Anyways, based on what you've said, if you can't tell the difference between 2ms and a CRT, or and LCD contrast and a CRT then you most definitely cannot tell the difference between VGA and DVI. When i first started using DVI i thought i could... but it was all in my head, couldn't notice anything. As far as the move to HDMI goes, its not a computer standard output, and won't be because display port is going to take over, anyways, HDMI also can send high definition audio, main reason for its popularity, which still confuses me even on a TV because you still need to daisy chain the audio from the TV to most likely a receiver. However makes no sense on a computer as audio is always output separate anyways.
  10. luke992006

    luke992006 Geek Trainee

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    over the years i have had a lot of expirience with monitors, when a monitor handels sresponse times well you can not tell the difference between 2ms lcd and crt monitors, it is physically imposible, your eyes just can't.'

    hdcp had some probablems with vista before service pack one came out because vista did not handel anything hd well. The monitors could run at hd res's so that is where the conflict came in, not just because hdcp.

    how did i contradict myself there? i did not. But anyway, hdcp again is in the

    also, abviously anything can be repaired, but the fact is use just said that lcd's could last forever, and so could crt's if they were repaired each time they broke, and crt's are expensive to repair by the way. So kind of contradicted yourself there.

    it does not matter, lcd monitors handel colours better, and with the refresh rates are very simialr to crt performance.

    sorry if i missed some of the points in your last post.
  11. Crayola

    Crayola Geek Trainee

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    At the mo im using a 37" LG TV. However i get bad tearing and have to enable Vsync in games. Would getting a pc monitor with a low response time stop the tearing so i can play my games at a decent FPS.
  12. Swansen

    Swansen The Ninj

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    PM me, we'll figure it out from there, just to keep this out of the sticky, thanks.
  13. footgamer

    footgamer Geek Trainee

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    I agree with #11, I am also playing games like FPS using my LCD
  14. Jan Benedict

    Jan Benedict Geek

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    are CRT Monitors/TV the same as plasma TVs?

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